Episode 10 - What Do A Marriage Celebrant & Divorce Coach Have In Common?

podcast Oct 26, 2022
Do Divorce Right
Episode 10 - What Do A Marriage Celebrant & Divorce Coach Have In Common?
28:40
 

The Do Divorce Right podcast is a new podcast dedicated to looking at the many different aspects of divorce,  interviews with women who have their own incredible divorce stories or those who can offer some great advice as you go through yours. Hosted by Becca Maxwell, a divorce coach and relational intelligence consultant, the focus here is to help you to find the strength and support to help you heal, feel lighter and in a better frame of mind to face the inevitable challenges of your divorce journey.

In this episode, Becca interviews Michelle Boyd who is a coaching professional and speaker and a marriage celebrant. She talks about what inspired her to become a marriage celebrant and to serve others as a speaker.

Listen to Michelle who aims to deliver education, inspiration, and entertainment to a variety of audiences and believes we all have a choice to make our life whatever we want it to be and that includes your dream wedding!

You can find Michelle at www.lovemichelleboyd.com

On Instagram at: @lovemichelleboyd

 

Audio Transcript

Becca 

Welcome to the do divorce right podcast. I'm your host, Becca Maxwell. And I'm here to help you transition through your divorce with ease and integrity, to not only survive the challenges of your divorce, but to thrive as you come out the other side of it with a much better life than you ever hoped possible. On this show, we talk about many different aspects of divorce, interview women who have their own incredible divorce stories, or those who can offer some great advice as you go through yours. The focus here is to help you find the strength and support to help you feel lighter, happier, more positive, and then a better frame of mind to face the inevitable challenges of your current journey.

Becca

All right, I'm very excited today to be talking to another beautiful human. Michelle Boyd is here to join me for a discussion on the do divorce rate podcast. And I think listeners are going to really love hearing about how many parallels Michelle and I have had and yet ended up being essentially the opposite ends of the business of love. I spoke to my daughter this morning, I dropped her off at school. I said, I'm really excited. I'm interviewing a marriage celebrant today. And she said, really? Are you going to fight with this is that it's like, Oh, what about marriages, bad divorces, bad marriages? No.

Michelle 

Wow, that's fascinating. Isn't? Watch. She said yeah.

Becca 

And I love that your reaction was the same as mine, which was just to laugh out loud. I told her that that was the cutest thing. Anywho. So I've given away the surprise of that, which really isn't one given. It's in the title. But Michelle is a speaker, a speaking coach and a marriage celebrant and I'm at the other end as a divorce coach. So Michelle, would you mind telling us a little bit more about what led you to becoming a marriage celebrant?

Michelle 

Wow, okay. Marriage celebrate. came about I after I got married. I'm not sure what part to tell you of my story just yet. But anyway, after I got married, I could go into more detail later. Yeah. And I had wedding vows that were kind of long in comparison to my husband. My wedding vows were almost two pages long, which now that I'm a celebrant, I want to talk myself out of it. And my partner, my husband had very short vows. Anyway, I just didn't want the whole ceremony to end I was just caught up in the excitement, the love the moments and all of it. I just didn't want to do any. So it was a really positive experience. Getting married. Anyway, I have been involved in Toastmasters for a couple of years, and

Becca 

which is public speaking and public speaking. Yeah,

Michelle 

I was doing really well at winning awards. And I thought, I think I need to, to follow something here. And that's why I decided to work with some of my talents. And that was speaking and obviously on my wedding day, I was faking,

Becca 

just proving to everybody that you're good at standing up.

Michelle 

My beautiful husband, he stood there, he listened the whole time whether he can remember anything I say? Probably not. But you know, we're together. And yet he still has to listen to me speak

Becca 

today. So it was the love of speaking the love of the environment of a wedding. And was there anything else that drew you to being a marriage celebrant?

Michelle 

Well, I, when we got married, I just went through the motions of getting everything sorted to get married. And I didn't realise all of the options and choices that were out there. So now that I'm a celebrant, my aim is to help people understand that they can have their wedding, any way that they like, and they have choices. They have choices as to who marries them and then they have choices as to how they have their ceremony. I find it really empowering to be able to let people have free rein on something so important. To help guide them in the process.

Becca 

Yeah, beautiful. I remember when we spoke previously, and you said you feel like you've got one of the best jobs in the world. Yeah, it's funny because I feel that way too, right and can completely the other end you wouldn't imagine. But what I love about my job is that people come with less of an idea that this could be a positive experience and then Through working together, they can understand that there is an opportunity to move on and create a beautiful life. And it can be a bit like with designing a wedding, it can be by design and by choice. And so you'd said you have one of the best jobs in the world and to get me to isn't this great? So that's one of the things we have in common. And there's so many more. And I'm sure it'll be no surprise to my listeners, given the topic of this podcast, that you've gone through quite a journey, including a divorce, right? To be where you are today. And can we hear a bit more about that story about the first marriage and leading you through to divorce to where you are?

Michelle 

Wow, well, that is a totally different story and feels like a totally different life, to where I am. Geez, what point do I pick up and start that conversation? How the marriage broke down? Or how

Becca 

old were you when you got together? And how, how many kids did you have? When did you start seeing the cracks in the marriage? Is that Yeah, all right. Well,

Michelle 

I was 23, when we got married, and we'd been together almost two years prior to that. And then went straight into having baby. Yeah, and I have four children. And I had

Becca 

the same father, husband, number one, got it all

Michelle 

children under the age of so within six years, I had watch

Becca 

Goodness gracious, that's a lot on your plate, miss out. It was

Michelle 

and it was a relationship that didn't really have the blessing of my family. They could, I could kind of see a lot of differences. And at the time, I was so young and swept up in everything that I'm

Becca 

surprised they didn't buy in after all these beautiful grandchildren that you've bought into, they're

Michelle 

still enjoying because you're 100% and they and they were there. They didn't try and pull us apart or anything like that. There was some tension, you know, not all families get along perfectly together.

Becca 

I don't think many.

Michelle 

Yeah. And the birth of my children. Um, I actually suffered postnatal depression. I would say three times, but probably only documented twice. Wow. Wow. Yeah.

Becca 

I'm sorry to hear that.

Michelle 

On, on me going through it mentally, on the children and so on.

Becca 

Yeah, marriage.

Michelle 

So that was, that was really hard. And he did the best that he could. And the cracks happened when we decided to do things that everyone says you shouldn't do. And that is we moved. When I had a sixth. Our fourth child was six weeks old. We live from Brisbane to Ken and his family were there and his family were lovely and very supportive. But it was new. I didn't have friends. The temperature was extreme change for me. Very humidity thing. And the postnatal depression kicked in again. Yeah, I had been Yeah, sort of listed as for nurses to watch out just because I had had it previously. And so I did get help. Very quickly. It just didn't help our relationship. Yeah.

Becca 

Right. You mentioned people told you what you should or shouldn't do in terms of moving away I guess from your your family structure. I've never been a big fan of should. And I think we need to learn our own exploits from our own experiences, right? If we're going to make mistakes, let us make them for ourselves. Don't tell me what I should or shouldn't do that might be there. bracingly Yeah. I've made plenty of mistakes, but I own them. So the cracks in the relationship. You've mentioned postnatal depression. You've mentioned being away from your family. What age were you when you separated and started going through divorce? Maybe tell us about whether that was an amicable choice, whether that was, you know, discussion that you were able to sit down together and make

Michelle 

to be fair, our relationship wasn't great. He was aware of that and we both tried really hard. get everything going. We do agree, counselor together to try and have some relationship counseling. We had a trial separation, we ended up back together. And then I went on a holiday with the children. And things just didn't seem quite right. And when I was away, I was so different in myself. I was so happy, it was like we're had that person be,

Becca 

even though you still had the four children, and you were still very much. It was just the absolute right?

Michelle 

It was just like, I I became I don't know, it was just sort of like something had lifted off me. And I was having a great time and he wasn't around. And and then bahala was away, we had some great conversations on the phone. So the cracks were well, and truly, it was turning into an earthquake, you know, tectonic plates, were really separating it that. I remember. I was I must have just been over, around 30.

Becca 

Okay, beautiful. I remember taking some early holidays before the marriage ended, picked up the kids and went off and took some adventures on my own. And it was almost like a trial single mums situation like, what does this look like? Could I even could I even do this if I had to? And I like you I was on these holidays just going oh, my God, this is so much better. Not having to manage the other person who was not doing enough or whatever the issues were. But you know, just feeling like myself again. Not because I was on holiday still a mum? I don't think it's a holiday when you're taking little kids around, you know, not riding on a different life. Yeah. So when you did choose to split, so there's tectonic plates that come this shifting in other directions. You have had a couple of conversations, you've tried to make it work. It's clear, it's not gonna work. Was it amicable at that point?

Michelle 

It was right, we had a conversation. The steps were put into place extremely quickly of how we were going to separate was very platonic with regards to our possessions and we got to moving. And yeah, that was photonic.

Becca 

Yeah, yeah. So at the beginning of the split, you've made some early agreements, you were able to both align, not argue about those. I'm hearing at that time. And so I'm assuming that there's a period where it becomes less low conflict, maybe it turns into a high conflict situation, how long do you think those two periods were? Because like, it's not at all uncommon, that the early stages of a separation, you can come to some great agreements amicable? Usually about a year, a year or two. And then it can become more high conflict, as frustrations come up, egos get in the way, you know, arguments happen. So how long do you think it was?

Michelle 

Maybe two months.

Becca 

Wow. So you made the agreement. Everything was great for two months, and then all of a sudden, it wasn't great anymore.

Becca 

So we don't need to dwell on the specifics at all. But can you give me maybe an idea of, of what this conflict was like, or what the less amicable version of dealing with your ex husband who's co parenting?

Michelle 

Yeah, just probably put it nicely was I wanted to go down the track with with the law, and with the assistance that was provided and follow the steps that I knew that I had been told, and that was all that I knew. It was, you know, have mediation work on an agreement together for the care of the children. And I just wanted to follow that steps that were out there didn't know anything else. And I don't think that's the way he wanted to do it. He wanted to do it his way. And yeah, we did not come to any agreement. We did end up having quite a long process that then went to court to have the became your children. This guided

Becca 

for you? Yeah, I'm sorry to hear that. Do you mind sharing? Or do you even remember some of the techniques and ways in which you helped yourself get through that really tough time?

Michelle 

Well, I, to be honest, when it became not amicable, I probably said things that I shouldn't have said. I went through that anger stage. And then I do know that I pulled myself in check. And I did not say anything bad about the children's father in front of the children

Becca 

ever. Yeah. Yeah.

Michelle 

I didn't want that. They may have already sent my feeling towards him, but I did not say anything to them. Or try and sway them to think a certain way about it.

Becca 

So hard, isn't it? You bite your tongue, but Oh, it's so hard not to say anything. But do you feel like that's benefited your relationship with your children, that children's relationship with their father, what benefits came out of you really holding yourself together? And

Michelle 

I definitely think that, you know, the kids, remember, and they say things. And they, you know, have have said what they can see one parent doing and and what the other so they can remember it. And I think that I'm glad that I do that. The way that I did it, because that's how I want my children to remember me and to know me. Yeah. Yeah. Beautiful.

Becca 

How old are your children now?

Michelle 

That my baby is 16. Now, a man to put this into context for everyone. He was 18 months?

Becca 

Wow. That's okay. That's a long time ago. No. Okay, and now. Your children are older, they look back, they respect you for the way in which you behaved they appreciate you, I guess I might be using words. What words would you say the children would use to describe the way you behave? But the time

Michelle 

I behaved at

Becca 

the time? Well, for the last 16 years, you know, how would they describe?

Michelle 

I think, um, I know that my daughter has said, You did really well, mom, or what have you raised up? You know, and the kids say that. And they turn around and say, you know, they're proud of me to be their mom. And we have a great relationship. You know, I'm happy with how the children have grown up and that

Becca 

we feel so good. Yeah, it does. Nobody gets awards for parenting. I think we all should. But that's the award that I'm going for. I want my children to look back and tell me I did a good job. At some

Michelle 

point. And you know, it might be a while before you get. Yeah, the kids have got to see different things as they get older to realize what parenting is all about. Sure. Yeah.

Becca 

Absolutely. And how is your relationship with your ex husband now?

Michelle 

It's really good. And I find that hard to believe myself. Our relationship is really good. And I'm just trying to think of how long it's been really good. Potentially the last three to four years. So with a long time of not great. Yeah. But we, he's always been there for the kids. He's attended school functions. And when our kids have made us, you know, proud special moments where they've received awards or, you know, become school captain or things like that. We've stood there side by side. And I don't think anybody would even know that we were divorced. Yeah, you know, we've stood there beside our children, except

Becca 

that you've got a husband on the other side, but that give the clue away. Not not always

Michelle 

had my husband there with me for those events, because it was either, you know, during school hours, and he was working. So he's a bit more behind the scenes kind of

Becca 

man. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. Beautiful. Michelle, that's so great. Looking back. So I asked you about choices that you made, you said that you chose not to speak in a negative way about your ex husband, and that seems to have had a really positive impact on your relationship with your children. Is there any other advice that you would pass on to somebody else who is really struggling to imagine 15 years from now? Or, you know, the idea that there might be a husband in the future you let me come back to that actually, you were a single All mom in your 30s with four kids. Right now, how was dating?

Michelle 

Well, that was a, you know, a huge step for me to actually decide whether to walk away to you know, there's a year of, ah, well, you know, do I focus on myself? And is anyone gonna want me with four kids? Or do I focus on what I want for their children, and that's why I'm leaving. And whatever happens happens. And I've put so much of my focus on kids that I didn't really think too much about that. And for the first 12 months, that we were separated. I don't even think I looked at a man. You know, I was healing. Yeah, I was grieving and old person, and also discovering a new person and letting myself come out again, if that makes sense.

Becca 

Definitely. Yeah, that's

Michelle 

so beautiful. Then when I you asked how to dine, date or meet or whatever. Interestingly, some new friends that I've made to where I'd moved that me up on a blind date, and beautiful, I told him all about, you know, me with, okay, concern, and he still met me. And we've been together ever since. Yeah, that's gorgeous.

Becca 

I can totally relate to the idea of choosing to potentially be alone forever. Rather than stay in an unhappy relationship. I remember being just shared something kind of vulnerable. So unhappy in the marriage that I knew we needed to leave. And I was living in Asia, and I was 40 already. And I just thought, I'm going to be sexless. For the rest of my life, there is no way I'm going to meet a man in Asia, who wants to meet a woman in her 40s with two kids, it's not going to happen. I've gone on to meet a beautiful man and then have a beautiful blended family. So at the time, you just think it's never gonna happen for me, but potentially the you know, the benefits of having your children not raised in that environment, just to compelling them to stay?

Michelle 

Yeah. Ah, so like, words of advice for people who I mean, are we talking to, to your audience of people who are thinking of getting divorced or people who already are?

Becca 

Well, let's talk about the women who have already separated, perhaps they're in the thick of not getting along with their ex at the moment, not sure how this is going to play out? I can't imagine that their future is going to be a positive one.

Michelle 

Okay, well, 100%. For me, it was focusing on myself, like, setting goals for myself not feeling like I needed to be dependent on any other partner. You know, whether they're coming out of a same sex relationship, or whether they're coming out of a, you know, male or female relationship, just that not getting enough strength in yourself. So you don't feel like you're dependent on anybody is such a great way to like a state to get to. It was a rediscovery, isn't it? It is it's a rediscovery. And it's, it's learning how to be confident in yourself. And, you know, it can take some people forever, and then it can take some people not very much time at all. But I think without you even knowing you will be far more attractive to anybody, when you are happy. And if you can focus on yourself and becoming happy and confident without even knowing people will be looking at you and admiring you

Becca 

and it almost doesn't matter at that point. It doesn't matter if you're attracting anybody to you because you don't need them. You like yourself enough. And that's such a beautiful place to be. I have in my program, I have quite a lot around rediscovering this fabulous, phenomenal human that you are like, let's figure it out without the constraints of barriers without the compromises of having to live with somebody else and make decisions with them. What do you like to do with your time Who are you what are you great at and it's such a nice journey to watch people go through.

Michelle 

It can make you cry as you are trying to discover yourself, you're like peeling off the layers of the onion. It really can but it's worth it. Well enjoy Oh,

Becca 

when when you met your who became your current husband? Were you hesitant to marry again?

Michelle 

Actually, yes. Like I was we were together eight years before we got there. And I, yeah, I hadn't wanted to get married. I think I was at marriage for a long time

Becca 

and then became a marriage celebrant. anymore.

Michelle 

I'm on the other side now. Yeah. So I was, you know, not really, not really looking to get married. Because at the time, I thought that that kind of locked me in and that was still are still healing, if he can look at it that way, when I realized that he was never going to lock me in, even if we got married. And, you know, I love him so much for that we have different interests. And we go, you know, and do a lot of things on our own and come together. And it's just, it's nice to be able to have freedom within a relationship, but still have trapped and you know, we have

Becca 

so much. Yeah, beautiful. Michelle, thank you so much for your time. So I don't think many of my listeners are knocking on your door just yet. But when they're looking for you, when they're looking for a celebrant to help them come up with a beautiful ceremony that is unique and different and interesting, and exactly what they're looking for. How do they find you?

Michelle 

Okay, well, I have a website called lovemichelleboyd.com. Also on Instagram, love Michelle Boyd, and on my show, boy.

Becca 

Yeah, but I just hope somewhat, I hope people are inspired by your story. I feel like there's, there's so many commonalities for us through this right. We've both been through a pretty shitty divorce, we've both taken our children and created a different life for ourselves. We've both held our tongue, about, you know, complaining about the ex-husband, for the benefit of the children. And for the long run. We've gone on to find love again, we've gone on to build beautiful businesses, we think we have the best jobs in the world. And we get to meet gorgeous other women like this. I love it. Yeah,

Michelle 

we do. We have a lot in common. And, you know, I do worry a lot of people who have been married before, and I don't know if they feel a sense of shame or guilt sometimes when they say, Oh, I've been married before, I just want that to be thrown away. You know, I don't want anyone to ever be ashamed of it. And one from me, been through it myself. If it hasn't worked and you have moved on, it's for the better of you and for your ex. Yeah, you can both die and make the life that you want. And if you do find somebody and get married, you know, again, then that's, that's a new chapter in your life. And I don't think that that takes anything away from marriage. A great

Becca 

Michelle, thank you so much for your time.

Michelle 

Thank you.

Becca

Thanks for listening. I hope you took something of value out of this episode. I'm your host, Becca Maxwell. And you can find me on the web at do divorce right.com on Instagram at do divorce, right. I look forward to connecting with you there.

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