Episode 23 - Finding resilience post-divorce despite culture and chaos
Feb 02, 2023
In this episode, Becca interviews Maura Webster. She is an incredibly inspiring individual, with life stories and experiences as varied as strategist, marketer, motherhood, podcaster business owner and cancer survivor to her name! Further adding to this impressive resumé of accomplishments she has become sought after for her marketing coaching skills among creative solopreneurs, entrepreneurs, startups, small businesses around the world - culminating in hosting her own successful podcast series full of value-packed content!
Now however it's time for us all to really hear about Maura’s divorce story which promises engaging insights into how one can come out stronger from turmoil.
Visit her website:
Listen to her Podcast:
https://podcasts.apple.com/au/podcast/super-real-human/id1567278261
Audio Transcript
Becca
Welcome to the do divorce right podcast. I'm your host, Becca Maxwell. And I'm here to help you transition through your divorce with ease and integrity, to not only survive the challenges of your divorce, but to thrive as you come out the other side of it with a much better life than you ever hoped possible. On this show, we talk about many different aspects of divorce, interview women who have their own incredible divorce stories, or those who can offer some great advice as you go through yours. The focus here is to help you find the strength and support to help you feel lighter, happier, more positive, and then a better frame of mind to face the inevitable challenges of your current journey.
Becca
Amazing. All right, so today this week on the Do Divorce Right podcast I'm delighted to be talking to Maura, Maura Navin. Maura Navin Webster even - so we can talk about names a little bit more detail.
Maura is a strategist, a marketer, a mum, a podcaster, a business owner, a cancer survivor, and an all- round inspiring human being. As a marketing coach Maura works with creative solopreneurs, startups, entrepreneurs, small business owners, and she shares so much epic value in her own podcast.
And yet, this is the first time we're really hearing about your divorce story, Maura, so I'm excited about that.
Thank you so much for joining us. Have I missed anything in the introduction? What else do you do? You seem to never be quiet!
Maura
I don't have much free time. So we'll leave it at that. But thank you so much for having me Becca. I'm so excited to be here.
Becca
That's amazing. Absolutely. My pleasure. So, I want to offer you a super warm welcome for being here. I'm really grateful that you're choosing to share your story. And I think let's start with the let's start with the background then, now let's talk about your marriage. And then we'll come to the divorce and why it's a positive divorce story.
Maura
Sure, sure. Okay, so on the on the way back time machine, my husband and I, we met at a summer camp. And I was living away. So we met at a summer camp in New Hampshire. Yeah. And I at the time was living in Washington, DC. I had come up for sort of alumni weekend. So it was a camp that I had been involved with, since high school and through college, had taken time away and sort of graduated from school and started my life and my career, but stayed involved with the
Becca
counsellor at the camp, not a child. Is that right? So
Maura
I was I was a counsellor. I never it's funny. I never attended the camp as a camper. I got involved as a counsellor in high school, beautiful, and was a counsellor for a few years. And then stayed involved in we have this sort of alumni group. And so I was heading up the girls camp alumni group. And so I was up for the summer. And just just a weekend during that summer, and lots of events were happening. And he caught my eye and, you know, we sort of flirted back and forth. And yeah, yeah, you're right, like a little, a little sense of romance. And by the end of the weekend, we decided we would give this long distance relationship a shot. He was the director at the boys camp. And I was flying back to Washington, DC after two days in New Hampshire. So we stayed in touch, there was lots of flying back and forth. And a year later, we got engaged in that same place where we had gotten together a boot camp. And about a year after that we got married.
Becca
Wow, that's fast. But I guess it was pretty quick. Yeah, I'm really in love. And yeah,
Maura
young. I love just making the decisions.
Becca
So you're from Washington, or you were studying in Washington. Logistically, let me just ask about that. Where were you both from? And how did you decide way? Sure.
Maura
Yeah. So I was from Massachusetts, and I still live. Once again, in the town that I grew up in the city I grew up in, but a half hour west of Boston. He grew up in Maine. Okay. And we met in New Hampshire. But at the time, so I had gone to college in Washington, DC. I had moved back to Boston, for my first job after school. My dad had been sick at the time, and I wanted to be closer to home, that I stayed about a year 13 months and then flew back for a job in Washington. Okay. But then he and I met, and I lasted in Washington, maybe four more months, and then I moved back home.
Becca
Okay, so families are all nice and close. They're not too far
Maura
apart. And not too far.
Becca
How quickly from getting married. I know that you've got two beautiful daughters. So how quickly from marriage did children come along?
Maura
So we started trying relatively soon. We were both really excited about having a family I think I wanted no fewer than two and no, he wanted no fewer than two. I want to know more than four. So we ended up with two. They came back to back we had actually struggled for a couple of years to get pregnant. And so we finally had our first daughter. He was born in August of 2000 and And five. And then our second daughter was born in October of 2006. Right there 14 months apart.
Becca
That's a lot of pressure on any marriage having to under two. Really quickly. Yeah,
Maura
very quickly. Yeah. And
Becca
how did your How did your marriage cope through that? I mean, I don't know where it started to unravel. So were you together for a long time.
Maura
We weren't together for a while we were together for 1516 years. And I start to finish. Yeah. And we we had a great I mean, we just sort of we were very busy, right. He was in he was a public teacher, a public school teacher, and then a principal, Vice Principal, and then a principal, all relatively local. And that was my mother's field. So they actually worked together, sort of in the early stages of our relationship, which was interesting. And then I had gotten into right after we got married, got into local politics, and was a city councillor. And so we were very much in the public eye from the beginning. And a tiny bit of backstory. That's sort of how I grew up. My dad was also in politics, locally and at the state level. And so I was sort of used to it. He definitely was not used to it. And so I think that was probably a big adjustment, right for him. But we, we sort of we played the game. Well. We hosted the parties, and we went to the things and you know, we did all the stuff. We did all the stuff. Yeah. And we were fortunate and that my parents were right here in town, and were great about spending time with the girls. And really, they my mom had retired by the time Maddie came along. And so she really took care of them. They never went to daycare, they went straight from hanging with my mom every day to school. That's when the time came lovely, isn't it? It was a beautiful thing.
Becca
Yeah. Okay. So how long until the marriage started to show signs that it wasn't doing so well? What did that look like?
Maura
We think one of our first struggles was probably around eight, nine years in. And the connection just wasn't there. The connection had been lost. We'd both sort of, I think we had started to grow individually in our careers and what we were interested in, but we weren't connecting, we were almost like, you know, ships passing in the night. And so we talked through it, and we, we were able to bring it back around and refocus on our relationship. We went away for our 10th anniversary. And we went to the British Virgin Islands for a week, which was delightful. And my mom it was it was sort of a a huge blessing because my mom had been ill my mom had breast cancer and been through breast cancer treatment. And so she got better and offered to you know, stay with the kids for a week. And so my parents and his parents kind of swapped off and the girls had a great vacation week, that week. And it was good. It was really good. It wasn't it wasn't that newlywed, you know, good again, but I felt like we had reconnected and things were good.
Becca
Okay. That was in, there was no expectation that there was an expectation it would work out, right, you would get this period and it would be okay.
Maura
Yeah, but we will get through it. We work through it and it'd be fine. It's not necessarily the reality and it wasn't in our case. You know, we got back to reality. And things started to fade, sort of the reconnection started to fade as we got back into life and in sort of the schedule of everything. And so that was probably 2000 and beginning of 2013. And my mom actually passed in August of that year, and it went pretty quickly from May of that year, so May of 2013. And basically the breast cancer had metastasized. We thought it was gone. All the specialist thought it was gone. And it came back with a vengeance and had metastasized to her brain. And it was very quick from that point
Becca
before you were able to spend quality time with her at the end. Yes, so
Maura
my parents actually lived with us. Okay, starting in about 2009 challenging
Becca
and then we move parents in Great. All right. Yes.
Maura
There were definitely some factors, right. That was that was challenging, much more so it was a blessing. Very helpful, and also really challenging and I didn't realise until mom was gone. What a mediator. She really was a sort of a silent, everything got done magically. Right. So I could work late and he could work late and things were I mean, it was just very well orchestrated. She was brilliant in that regard. But one of the turning points for me was when we knew she was nearing the end. And it was one of the last conversations she and I had in the kitchen. And when she was Italian, we all love to cook. So we were often power struggle in the kitchen. But so we were chatting one night, and she looked at me, and it was just the two of us. And she said, You're not happy? And I see it.
Becca
Did you know that? Did you know? I did? Yeah,
Maura
I did. And I didn't know. I didn't know that there was a way out of it, or a way to fix it being so public, and I wasn't in office anymore. But I just didn't. I didn't know that it could be done. Because I'd seen everybody sort of struggling not struggle, but just deal with it. If they weren't happy they were in it. And it was, you know, the way the stories I heard growing up was you just stick it out? Yeah. And
Becca
I'd love to hear a little bit more about that. And I, you mentioned that you were from an Italian family. You also mentioned that, you know, both families were nearby. Were there cultural expectations, then that divorce is just not an option. You mentioned, you kind of grew up with that narrative. But now your mom's highlighting something needs to change here. So what did that mean for your expectations of marriage and happiness and your ability to challenge those norms?
Maura
This is a really good question. It I definitely was sort of the expectation that divorce wasn't really an option. And we knew people who had been divorced and there was no no personal judgement on on my end of it, but it was this curiosity of how did you make it happen? Because what I hear this is not cool, right? This is not supposed to happen. Okay. Yeah, right. Not okay. And so I took the this conversation with my mom who was like, you need to follow your happy, right? And in my head, I'm like, there's the permission I've been waiting for. And you're not going to be here, mom to help me through it. Oh, the sort of that realisation of oh, okay, you're my biggest cheerleader. And we know you're not going to be here. So. Okay. All right. If you could pass that message on to everyone who's here still. So I have a little network, that would be great.
Becca
I need them to get you approve of this. Right?
Maura
No one's gonna believe me. No one's gonna believe me. So mom was the Italian dad was the stoic Irishman. Okay. Right. And so it was definitely very certainly don't divorce. Right. So very strict, Irish Catholic, Irish, Italian Catholic family. So really, I didn't think there was a way to do anything differently. So that for me was pretty big. And so then she passed. And I, probably for the first time, was just very, not detached, but just felt very disconnected. Right. And so I went through this period of six months, which in hindsight, is Oh, that's grief. Okay. I got it. And I didn't feel much of anything. No, not, not happiness, not sadness, not just not much of anything. I, my concern had been the girls. So since my mom was their caretaker while I was working, it was really important for me to make sure they were okay. And my youngest had real bad sort of separation anxiety once she was gone. My oldest daughter sort of stuffed it in a little bit. And so my goal was to help them with therapy. I had a therapist that it didn't really click, and I don't know that I was ready for it. Right. And, you know, in hindsight, I can see that now. But it was just a really interesting process. And in this process, my ex it we just grew further and further apart. Yeah. And when I needed someone to sort of be there and sort of pull me through it. That wasn't there.
Becca
Well, it sounds like you had grief on top of grief, how awful. Your there is a lot, this marriage that isn't working out, you did on a subconscious level, you've figured that out. Now, your mom's brought it to the front that your marriage isn't working out, and you need to start grieving that they all of the art, vacations of this being the happily ever after, and coming back together after a beautiful holiday together. And then you've got the very literal, very tangible grief of your mom not being there and not being able to support you and not being able to be there for the girls. So what, what a lot,
Maura
it was, it was hard. And in hindsight, we had been disconnected, right and not not through one of our faults over the other. And so he was feeling it too, right. And I'm at a place now where I can see more of that, right. And I think we've both over the years, have come to sort of acknowledge that we were both in it. And we were both out of it. Yeah,
Becca
and I do think that's interesting to a lot of people can't recognise that at the time that it's breaking apart, it's just so much easier to either distance, your own involvement, your own contribution to the fact that it didn't work out and kind of blaming the other person. But with distance, we all kind of get there. marriages don't just break down, because one person left, right, it's a cumulative effect of time, where you're just both on two very different paths. And yes, they might be a catalyst to it. They might be, you know, falling in love with somebody else or whatever, but often will come to a realisation later, it's going to be okay. My contribution to that was this, their contribution was this. And, you know, it was inevitable that it ended eventually. So well, we know your story does in looking at looking at a marriage in struggle and wondering if it's going to make it or not. Let me ask you, I'll jump the timeline a little bit. Do you have a relationship with your ex husband now?
Maura
I do. And I will say that we are coming, we're just on the other side of four, I will say four years of a lot of hard, toxic trauma fields back and forth. And so it wasn't when we when we split, we actually we went to therapy, not necessarily to turn things around for us, but to make sure we did it in the best way we could for our daughters,
Becca
and successful.
Maura
Um, there was a little bit of a snafu where they our oldest daughter actually found out because I had confided in a friend and the friend let it slip in front of her daughter who then reached out to my daughter. So did not it was a lot of therapy for it did not go as planned.
Maura
But I think it started off on a on the best note that it could have.
Becca
Okay, but it got
Maura
it got toxic and ugly. And, you know, I don't I like to focus on the positive typically. But it did it did he, he entered into another marriage. And it was not a positive experience at all for the girls. Right. And so after some struggle there, and really I just turned into my focus. My focus was always on the girls post divorce. And it just solely became on making sure that they were safe and cared for and so that meant that we had to change. I saw a change in sort of the parenting schedule. Yeah. You know, and so that we're we're pretty fresh off of that but things have been drastically improved. And it's much more in line with the vision I think we had at the beginning.
Becca
Okay, so let's, let's not dig too much into the details of it. It's, it's kind of necessary, really. But I'd love to hear what, what behaviours, what learnings would you have about setting aside some of that? You mentioned trauma, right, that toxicity of those four years and some real ugliness, how? What advice would you pass on for somebody who needs to set that down? In order to have a decent co parenting relationship moving forward? It's not easy. What advice would you have having done that yourself
Maura
is not easy. I think first and foremost, thinking of the kids, right, and they're, they take the lead now mine are older, right there, you know, in high school. And so I take their lead on, and that has been eye opening and interesting on so many levels, being there to support them through those decisions. And remembering that it's about them. The co parenting is about the kids, it's not about me, it's not about him, it's about what's best for the girls, okay. And the girls actually makes it a lot easier,
Becca
shows that they want you to have a relationship with Him, they want you to both be able to get along,
Maura
as they have always, they've always wanted us to be able to get along. Great. And that has varied, you know, I think over time, to the extent, but I think it makes it a lot easier now at their games and knowing that there are big events and you know, our oldest as a senior there are big events in her life. Yeah.
Becca
much optimism for the future, looking at that generation. I just think there's so much more emotionally intelligent than any generation I've seen before. Right? They just open and quite beautiful to the idea of trauma can be set aside or we can get over things. I'm quite impressed with our young people,
Maura
too, and they have been through so much in their short lives so far, that, you know, they've definitely had a lot of setbacks and a lot of challenges, to say the least. And That's putting it mildly. But just watching how they've sort of overcome and focus on Okay, but how did we grow? And how can we continue to move forward and do it in a way that we still feel excited and satisfied and all the good things?
Becca
Yeah, yeah, they're pretty impressive. Well, that's, that's incredible. And it also giving a lot of credit to you to be able to set aside that trauma and toxicity and decide that the girls need this, they deserve it, they, you know, your focus on them has allowed you to make some healthy decisions. How do you? Or do you exercise some of those ugly emotions of he was such a dick, or whatever it is. Do you have some suggestions on how people can deal with that kind of anger? And it doesn't just go away?
Maura
It doesn't go away. But I will say that it. I can look at it as though it's not mine. And I don't know, I don't know where that turning point was. That's because, right. I don't know where it changed from me taking it so personally and being so I would feel it in my chest. Yeah, right. Going through some of those challenging times. And it would take over. Right. And I had migraines, and it was very challenging. And then it came to this moment where I was like, I'm here for the girls. Yeah. Right. And if they need space, then they can take space. And if they are like, Great, let's all go to dinner. Great. Let's all go to dinner.
Becca
Yeah, okay.
Maura
Right. So it's very interesting. And you know, just the other night, we we were all at
Maura
our daughter's basketball game. Yeah. And, you know, it was one of those. I turned to my younger daughter on the bleachers and I was like, Hey, listen, we're gonna go to dinner afterward. Our cousin is going to come, I'm like, do you want to ask your dad? And because they're not, he's about an hour away now. And so they don't spend the overnights at his place. Right. And so I said, Do you want to see if he wants to come to dinner? You know, you're more than welcome. And she she was excited. She said, Yeah, yeah, great. That's awesome. And I was like, Okay, great. We all went to dinner. And we left and you know, sort of, despite everything, I turned to him, and I said, I'm just I'm grateful that you're going on. Right? I'm grateful that like, you stuck it out because they were kind of done for a while. And this is great. This is, this is good.
Becca
Maura, one of the one of the things I hear myself repeating to my clients, quite often is that I know that they're coming out the other end of the grief when they can use the word grateful. Especially when it's spontaneous, when you can have gratitude, not necessarily for the rubbish you've been through, but gratitude about anything to do with the relationship with the children, the relationship as it is now versus as it was, then then you know, that that really painful period of grieving is behind you. So gratitude to me is a superpower. And then the more we can do to cultivate that, the better. And you know, it's just so healing. That's lovely. Now, we're at the bleachers at the basketball game and inviting your ex husband to dinner. Is he still with the wife? No. Okay. And are you in a relationship now?
Maura
I am. I am. I know. I get all giddy. Lovely, right. I feel like it in my mid 40s. It's absolutely wonderful to feel guilty about being in that in that state. And so I've been with my partner, my boyfriend Darren for. Okay, I'd have to count since shortly after the divorce. Okay, on our first official date, but we've known our families actually, we weren't we used to work together. And so our families actually have vacation together. And our kids went to summer camp together when they were little. So we've actually been in each other's sphere. Yeah. For a while. And we were friends first, which is so I think powerful and a relationship. wherein I think he probably knew a lot of my quirks before, before he was willing to say, Hey, you want to go is my date to this dinner? And so yeah, it's wonderful in between us that we have for four daughters. We they're like Bing, bing, bing, bing, bing.
Becca
Do you live under the same roof? Is it any kind of we do not.
Maura
We do not live under the same roof, which is a challenge. So he actually lives in New Hampshire, and I live in Massachusetts. Okay, so we're about an hour apart from each other. And one of the things that when we first decided to give the relationship thing a shot, was he's not moving his kids and I'm not moving mine.
Becca
No, not at this age. No, they've got to get out into college. And you must have some really exciting plans. Like just in a few years time I get to
Maura
we do talk about it. We do talk about it. My my Emma is the youngest out of all of them. So she graduates. She's a sophomore in high school. So she graduated a couple years. Yeah. And we talked about it. No, sorry. Emma, get
Becca
out. Get out.
Maura
Right. Yeah, no, there's no there's none of that happening. But we I mean, we talk about it. And we're like, you know, we'll see there's no, we're good. Right? There's no, there's no rush. I mean, it's hard. And it was funny. My niece actually the other night she was like, auntie, is it hard? Is it hard being so far away from Darren? And I was like, yeah, it is kiddo. It is
Becca
empathy that I'm talking about. This is the emotional maturity of the younger generation. It's just so beautiful that she can see that in you. Yeah, and I'm sure it is hard, but but worth it, presumably worth it. Yeah. Clearly lit you up when I asked you and you just lovely. I wanted to ask you about your work. Now. You were in the public eye when you were married. That's clearly not what you're doing now. And I think I'm really excited about what you do. When did when did you kind of pivot from being in politics and in the public eye to creating your own business and being a boss mom,
Maura
being a boss mom, I had. I was your one job between two jobs between. So from I left public office and worked at the Heart Association for a while in communications for New England, which was great. I got to do fun media stuff and fundraising and it was a blast was great cause but from there, I reconnected with my very first boss from 12 years prior, yeah. To go work for a tech company. And I did marketing for them. And within three years, we were bought by our biggest competitor. And it was the year after my mom passed. And I've found myself not wanting another job.
Becca
I think If I if I remember this back to your timeline, you were in a double grief at this point. And now you're going through a career transition as well. Yes. What was going on in your stars that year? Like that was a?
Maura
They were not working. Looking back, they were probably all working in my favour. Yeah. But it was definitely one of those years where I was like, like, Could anything like where's the other shoe is
Becca
left to drop in order to build back up again? Yeah, all of
Maura
And I definitely felt that. So as I found out that they were going to, they didn't need to marketing directors anymore. I handled it surprisingly well. And I had been on the other side, I had done layoffs before. And I was in middle management. So I got it. But I also knew that I was passionate about doing marketing in a way that felt good, that didn't chase somebody else's strategy and wasn't always answering someone else's jab that they were trying to throw at you. But really, through being authentic and transparent. That's how we grew the business in those three years that I was there, and I knew that it could be translated and help people who were just starting out, or doing good in the world. So I that's what I wanted. I wanted to do it and feel good about my work. Yeah. And so I kind of jumped right in. And at first I did any marketing, you need to do you need social media grades, you need a website? Sure. I'll build it, I'll figure it out. It'll be fine. And I remember about six months in, I started to work with a friend who I had known a little bit through work, and she was a business coach. And I was like, oh, a business coaching sounds like a wonderful thing. I had no idea what it was. And we started working together, we got really, really close. And she was like, You're just five years behind me. Trust me, this will be you. And I was like, No, I need to do something tangible. I need to like produce documents and things.
Becca
Yeah. And pay the bills. Yeah, too good. Because
Maura
now, yeah, every single month, right, right. And so I didn't, I didn't know what at the time, but I did. I knew it was coming. And so it was really important to me to start and get strong in this business, as a business owner, get the support I needed, and figure it out and do it quickly. And the same thing that came along with that, which was so interesting to me was really opening up to, to personal development to sort of this side of me that I think that I know actually came from my mom, but very spiritual, very connected to universe very kind of Woo. And it, it, it helped. It really did sort of helped me put everything into perspective in my life really get reconnected with my true self shed all those public layers of the person I had become and portrayed because it was what was expected created. Yeah. And created. And yeah, it sort of all just kind of came together. And so now, what I do is really help other entrepreneurs and small business owners figure it out. Yeah, and share with them sort of the path that I've been on and, and really build marketing in a way that feels good to them. Yeah, you know, kind of what they do well,
Becca
paying it forward, isn't it? It's like I've learned all of these things I need you to, I need you to take them forward with you so that you can also do well in the world. That's how it's done lesson.
Maura
Yeah, it's
Becca
beautiful.
Maura
It is it's wonderful. And it's the my most favourite thing. Like I still have a very strategic brain that loves to like, figure it out and do strategy and I'll do that with bigger companies. But I love my mastermind group. I love my one on one coaching with entrepreneurs right like those are the things that light me up. Yeah. So
Becca
so on that then how do people find you?
Maura
People can find me right now on Instagram. They can find me at www.lillablu.com
Becca
Beautiful. Of course.
Maura
Okay, awesome. Great. And lillablu.com Yeah, I'm also on Facebook and LinkedIn and all the places but you can search me through lillablu, or you can search me through more uneven
Becca
and you work with people internationally, right?
Maura
Yes, yeah, no boundaries, my lovely.
Becca
My clients and moms that I talked to and you know, people going through divorce are trying to figure out what do they do with their career? It's one thing to pay the bills but it's another thing to do something that you care about, and you're talking about. Yours was extraordinary with everything being burned down to build up again, that's that was a lot to go through. But in many cases this the ending of a marriage is the burning down of the house metaphorically to build something new. And a lot of people do go into new careers. They want to figure out how can I do what I love and not just what I thought I was supposed to do. Now that I've got this blank sheet of paper to decide what my futures gonna be an I've got all of these options and choices I can make for myself. That's, that's a really exciting time to work with people. And so
Maura
I love it, it's a really exciting time to be able to share the mindset shifts, I think for me, that helped, especially through the divorce and that rebuilding, to be able to still give the energy to doing what I love and making it work making it happen. There's definitely juggling. There are some hard days, but at the end of it, it really can be beautiful and exciting and all the good things.
Becca
Yeah. So what is there anything that we've missed in your story? I did jump forward. And we didn't necessarily come back to how did it really end? And what did that look like? Did you want to share anything from that? Or do you feel like we've gotten to the juicy bits?
Maura
I think we definitely covered a lot of juicy bits, as you had mentioned, I haven't really shared the story, right? Because there's a lot to it. Right? There was a it's been a roller coaster ride, I'm assuming that it will continue to have its ups and downs. You know, I think we ended it as best we could, given the circumstances. I think it's just challenging no matter what is behind it. And
Becca
to know what happened from the the end, which sounds like it went okay, neither of you were especially attached to the idea that the marriage had to work out. I'm reading between the lines here, so please correct me if I'm wrong. From that to the toxic part. Right. So when he got married very quickly, so was there it was there a catalyst to turning a well intentioned, you know, good divorce, if you like, to something that was quite ugly that looking back on it, you would like to revisit or would have liked to have things done differently? Could it have been avoided that toxic trauma?
Maura
I don't know, because I think the influence was external. Yeah, yeah. I think it was outside of our trying to co parent and trying to maintain that relationship.
Becca
So I see a new business here, which is teaching new step moms. How not to fuck it up like?
Maura
I definitely I you know, what, I I, I wish I had that sort of that that hindsight to see, you know, where was it? Was there something that I could have done differently? Right, was there something that he could have done differently? If there's something that, you know, together, we all could have done differently? It was, I thought, you know, in my, in my perspective, I thought we, we did as best we could I don't think I think once we got to the point, like you had mentioned that, that we had accepted that we were dissolving the marriage and and moving forward independently. I think once we got to that point, things were good for a little while. Nice. And I think it was that balance of you know, as new relationships start to come into the picture. You now have other opinions on how divorces should look. Yeah. And they weren't necessarily in line with what we had started out. Trying to do. Yeah. And so I think that's, that definitely got challenging. Yeah,
Becca
you couldn't depicted that you certainly couldn't have anticipated that changing dynamic. But I, I see a book in that. I'm writing some books that at the moment, you know, do divorce right in co parenting do towards right with finances. And I do think that there's a you know, when somebody new comes into your life, how do we sit down and articulate to them, this is what we're what we're hoping to achieve here. A bit like when you and Darren had the conversation of Yeah, we want to, we want to work this relationship out. But I'm not leaving. My girls are here and I'm not leaving my girls are here. We need to broker what works for us. And I feel like your ex husband and his newer partner could have had more conversations that involved you and the girls to make sure that everybody was on the same page. But you certainly can't predict and anticipate the changes before they happen. It's all upon reflection, isn't it? That is
Maura
true. Hindsight is definitely 2020 in some of these scenarios.
Becca
Well, I also think that hindsight works for us in many ways, because you've been able to identify all this at a shit show that you've had to go through and think what a blessing actually, you've created this beautiful career and a gorgeous life. You have a wonderful relationship with your daughters, and now thankfully, their father is also in the picture in that relationship as well. And you've got a beautiful relationship with Darren and his girls off to Italy in the summer.
Maura
Yes, yes, very excited about that. It's going to be fun to have powers all together, which will be great.
Becca
So let me just wrap up and ask you, if you've got any advice for women who are probably in the thick of it now and can't imagine that it's going to look quite as nice as yours does at the other end. Do you have any advice for them on how they might do divorce? Right?
Maura
I would say first, put the kids at the forefront. And when it gets to the point where you just want to take out that frustration in any way you possibly can, to sort of breathe and realise that everyone's got their own perspective, and keeping the kids focus, like your focus on the kids helped me sort of realise, like, Okay, I'm doing this for them, like this is we're gonna go through this, and we're gonna get through this. Also having just really good support, I will say Darren listened to way more than I'm sure he wanted to. And my girlfriends were phenomenal. Yeah, in just sort of being there. And being supportive and stepping up for the kids really seeing how my friends and my family stepped up for the girls. Beautiful. I think we,
Becca
we have an opportunity to cultivate that, don't we and I do encourage people to ask for what you need, if you don't necessarily know what's going to be helpful. And sometimes, you know, just having someone sit on the sofa with you while you watch television is all that you need. And sometimes it's take my kids out of the house, so just need some space, you know, and not being afraid to ask for that. Because then you do cultivate the support that you're so grateful for.
Maura
Yeah, I would also say one other thing is staying focused on how you want the outcome to be. So there, there were times where I never thought we would ever get to a place where we could sit on the same bench on the same side of a gym, because for a long time. It wouldn't happen. It would not happen and staying focused on what we want, or what I wanted for the girls, what I wanted things to look like for them. Helped me just to keep my cool and to not probably say some of the things I really wanted to say.
Becca
Beautiful, I think that's beautiful. We're going to edge that in stone. Stay focused on what you want their desired outcome to be.
Maura
Yeah, that's gorgeous.
Becca
Thank you so much for your time.
Maura
Thank you. This was absolutely wonderful. Thanks for for being the catalyst for me to actually talk about it.
Becca
Thanks for listening. I hope you took something of value out of this episode. I'm your host, Becca Maxwell. And you can find me on the web at dodivorceright.com or on Instagram at dodivorceright. I look forward to connecting with you there.
